The Catholic Church vs. “the needs and preferences of the times”

[Mornac]

There are no doubt a number of theories about the two points you have raised, and they have more factual basis that you faith based theory.

--Factual? I like how you conveniently throw relativism out the window when ut suits your needs.

[Mornac]

Call me what you like, but I am not an expert on all things.

--Me neither.

What to you is the objective truth?

--Criminy. Why is it that I’m the one asking this question and no one will answer it except me. As if that weren’t enough, I’m asked time and time again to repeat the answer. Okay. Here we go once again:

Objective truth is a fact that remains a fact regardless of whether or not anyone observes it as such.

You seem to imply that there are only two types of people, the traditional Catholics and everyone else, who are relativists.

--I hold that there are two types of people: Those who believe that there is such thing as objective truth, and those who believe that truth is relative.

There is a difference between having an open mind and being a relativist.

--You can say that again. Relativists are the most closed-minded people I know.
 

There have been a lot of very bright and productive people who have contributed to the body of knowledge and who have contributed to the well being of mankind.

--Who said different?

Guess what, many of them were not Catholics.

--Who said different?

Albert Einstein comes to mind, and I think he was a Jew.

--Who said different?

Off hand I would probably make a better Jew than a Christian because my primary concern is the well being of mortal men rather than fretting about the hereafter.

--Self-evaluation noted.

In fact, if people did not fear the hereafter not being there they would probably have less use for the Christian religion.

--No doubt.

To my way of thinking there are two lives, the mortal or pnysical one and the spiritual one, which deals primarily with the hereafter and where we will end up after death.

--I have roughly the same belief only in my version the two are interdependent.

The idea that  when the lights went out for the last time that was all she wrote, so to speak, worried ancient people, and it may still worry people.  So they invented this hereafter thing to ease their fears, and the clerics held it over their heads in order to command their allegiance and to provide bandaids for  their mental problems.

--The idea that when the lights went out for the last time there may be some form of judgment, so to speak, worried ancient people, and it may still worry people.  So they invented this relativism thing to ease their fears, and the secular humanists held it over their heads in order to command their allegiance and to provide band-aids for their mental problems.

They had to justify their existence in some manner so they became thought police. In other words, salvation is the reward for good behavior and hell is the punishment for not behaving.

--They had to justify their existence in some manner so they became thought police. In other words, salvation is the reward for any sort of behavior and there is no punishment for not behaving.

When is the last time you heard of a person being rewarded or punished by God for his behavior?

--I’d have to think about it a bit, but off the top of my head I’d have to say it was when Our Lord, whilst dying on the Cross, told Dismas, “Amen I say to thee, this day thou shalt be with me in paradise.”

[Mornac]

Maybe a traditonalist cannot think?  Is that your problem?

--Nope.

If people wait for you to deliver the objective truth then they are in for a long wait.

--People have to first recognize that there is such a thing and that it can be known before I can even think about delivering anything.

You throw this truth bullshit around and yet you have swallowed the Catholic LOS?

--If that’s a question the response is in the negative.

You wouldn't know the objective truth if it hit you in the balls.

--Is that statement true or is it just a relative musing?

Maybe you need to talk to the man upstairs some more. His number is 911.

--No idea what you’re talking about.

[ivanm]

--Nope.
--People have to first recognize that there is such a thing and that it can be known before I can even think about delivering anything.
--If that’s a question the response is in the negative.
--Is that statement true or is it just a relative musing?
--No idea what you’re talking about.

I will assume that there is such a thing as a truth.  Now, what did you have in mind?

What does this dumb assed exercise buy you Mornac?  Try solitaire or cross words if you are bored.

[Mornac]

I will assume that there is such a thing as a truth.

--Assume all you like. That’s not what I’m asking.

Now, what did you have in mind?

--I want to know if you believe that there is such a thing as truth.

What does this dumb assed exercise buy you Mornac?

--The only exercise that’s been going on here is “How many ways can I evade Mornac’s question?” I’m not playing. You seem to be doing pretty good at it though.

Try solitaire or cross words if you are bored.

--What makes you think I’m bored?

[ivanm]

--Nope.
--People have to first recognize that there is such a thing and that it can be known before I can even think about delivering anything.
--If that’s a question the response is in the negative.
--Is that statement true or is it just a relative musing?
--No idea what you’re talking about.

Who is saying there isn't such a "thing"?  That is the basic problem, your "thing" is just an abstraction, which makes this exercise nothing more that mental masturbation.
Something tells me you are fishing and don't even know the answer yourself. 

[Mornac]

Who is saying there isn't such a "thing"?

--What “who”? I’m talking about you here and my question concerns whether or not you BELIVE there is such a thing.

That is the basic problem, your "thing" is just an abstraction, which makes this exercise nothing more that mental masturbation.

--You don’t get to make any comments about the “thing” unless or until you qualify by telling us whether or not you believe there is such a thing.

Something tells me you are fishing and don't even know the answer yourself.

--Obviously I don’t know the answer. Only you can know the answer as to whether or not you believe something.  Of course if you ever decide to tell me, then (and only then) I will know too.