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[Mornac]

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The Long Goodbye	Small | Large

[johnhp]

Mornac's rage against the Catholicism enjoyed by well over 99.9% of all Catholics is merely an expression of the rage he he has for his wife.  He is projecting his wife's refusal to subject herself to his fanaticism onto the rest of Catholicism.  He is a Mel Gibson waiting to happen.

[Mornac]

July 22, 2010

Who cares what the Church teaches?
Poll shows 62% of Catholics want to keep California’s liberal abortion laws -- or make getting abortions even easier

Forty-eight percent of self-identified Catholics oppose any changes to California’s liberal abortion laws, and 14% say the law should make it even easier for women to get abortions, a Field Poll released yesterday revealed.

Just 34% of poll respondents who identified themselves as Catholics said state law should be changed to make getting an abortion more difficult, while 4% had no opinion one way or the other, according to the Field Poll results.

The results were part of an overall portrait of California residents, painting them as one of the most pro-abortion electorates in the U.S. “There has been no change in California voters long-standing support for allowing women the right to a legal abortion,” said a summary of the results released yesterday by the Field Poll. “About seven in ten voters (71%) favor making no change to the state’s current abortion laws or making abortion easier to obtain. In addition, a similar 71% endorse the U.S. Supreme Court’s historic 1973 Roe v. Wade decision that granted women a constitutional right to abortion.”

The California results buck a national trend, where polls taken in recent years show that, overall, Americans have become increasingly pro-life.

The Field Poll did turn up some slivers of anti-abortion sentiment in the state. “The largest proportions of voters who take a contrary view and advocate making abortion harder to obtain exist among strong conservatives (52%), those who identify strongly with the Tea Party protest movement (48%), Vietnamese-Americans (45%), Republicans (40%), supporters of Carly Fiorina for U.S. Senate (39%), supporters of Meg Whitman for Governor (38%), moderate conservatives (37%) and Latinos (36%),” according to the Field Poll.

The poll was conducted between June 22 and July 5, and queried 1,390 registered voters across the state.

http://calcatholic.com/news/newsArticle.aspx?id=05b92f5e-f3ac-42f1-8606-8abdb64ac133

[Mornac]

The Conspiracy	Small | Large

[Mornac]

For the Love of God!	Small | Large

[Mornac]

Islam Overtaking Catholicism in France

by Soeren Kern
August 18, 2011

Islamic mosques are being built more often in France than Roman Catholic churches, and there now are more practising Muslims in the country than practising Catholics.
 
Nearly 150 new mosques currently are under construction in France, home to the biggest Muslim community in Europe. The mosque-building projects are at various stages of completion, according to Mohammed Moussaoui, the president of the Muslim Council of France (CFCM), who provided the data in an August 2 interview with the French radio station RTL.
 
The total number of mosques in France has already doubled to more than 2,000 during just the past ten years, according to a research report "Constructing Mosques: The Governance of Islam in France and the Netherlands." France's most prominent Muslim leader, Dalil Boubakeur, who is rector of the Grand Mosque of Paris, recently called for the number of mosques in the country to be doubled again – to 4,000 – to meet growing demand.
 
By contrast, the Roman Catholic Church in France has built only 20 new churches during the past decade, and has formally closed more than 60 churches, many of which are destined to become mosques, according to research conducted by La Croix, a Roman Catholic daily newspaper based in Paris.
 
Although 64% of the French population (or 41.6 million of France's 65 million inhabitants) identifies itself as Roman Catholic, only 4.5% (or 1.9 million) of those actually are practising Catholics, according to the French Institute of Public Opinion (or Ifop, as it is usually called).
 
By way of comparison, 75% (or 4.5 million) of the estimated 6 million mostly ethnic North African and sub-Saharan Muslims in France identify themselves as "believers" and 41% (or 2.5 million) say they are "practising" Muslims, according to an in-depth research report on Islam in France published by Ifop on August 1. The report also says that more than 70% of the Muslims in France say they will be observing the Islamic holy month of Ramadan in 2011.
 
Taken together, the research data provides empirical evidence that Islam is well on its way to overtaking Roman Catholicism as the dominant religion in France.
 
As their numbers grow, Muslims in France are becoming far more assertive than ever before. A case in point: Muslim groups in France are now asking the Roman Catholic Church for permission to use its empty churches as a way to solve the traffic problems caused by thousands of Muslims who pray in the streets.
 
In a March 11 communiqué addressed to the Church of France, the National Federation of the Great Mosque of Paris, the Council of Democratic Muslims of France and a Muslim activist group called Collectif Banlieues Respect called on the Catholic Church – in a spirit of inter-religious solidarity, of course – to make its empty churches available to Muslims for Friday prayers, so that Muslims do not have to "pray in the streets" and be "held hostage to politics."
 
Every Friday, thousands of Muslims in Paris and other French cities close off streets and sidewalks (and by extension, close down local businesses and trap non-Muslim residents in their homes and offices) to accommodate overflowing crowds for midday prayers. Some mosques have also begun broadcasting sermons and chants of "Allah Akbar" via loudspeakers in the streets.
 
The weekly spectacles, which have been documented by dozens of videos posted on Youtube.com (here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here and here), have provoked anger and disbelief. But despite many public complaints, local authorities have declined to intervene because they are afraid of sparking riots.
 
The issue of illegal street prayers was catapulted to the top of the national political agenda in France in December 2010, when Marine Le Pen, the charismatic new leader of the far-right National Front party, denounced them as an "occupation without tanks or soldiers."
 
During a gathering in the east central French city of Lyon on December 10, Le Pen compared Muslims praying in the streets to Nazi occupation. She said: "For those who want to talk a lot about World War II, if it is about occupation, then we could also talk about it [Muslim prayers in the streets], because that is occupation of territory. It is an occupation of sections of the territory, of districts in which religious laws apply. It is an occupation. There are of course no tanks, there are no soldiers but it is nevertheless an occupation and it weighs heavily on local residents."
 
Many French voters agree. In fact, the issue of Muslim street prayers – and the broader question of the role of Islam in French society – has become a major issue ahead of the 2012 presidential elections. According to a survey by Ifop for the France-Soir newspaper, nearly 40% of French voters agree with Len Pen's views that Muslim prayer in the streets resembles an occupation. Another opinion poll published by Le Parisien newspaper shows that voters view Le Pen, who has criss-crossed the country arguing that France has been invaded by Muslims and betrayed by its elite, as the candidate best suited to deal with the growing problem of runaway Muslim immigration.
 
French President Nicolas Sarkozy, whose popularity was at 25% in July – worse than any predecessor less than a year ahead of a re-election bid, according to the TNS-Sofres polling group – has been spooked by Le Pen's advance in the opinion polls. He now seems determined not to allow Le Pen to monopolize the issue of Islam in France.
 
Sarkozy recently called Muslim prayers in the street "unacceptable" and said that the street cannot be allowed to become "an extension of the mosque." He also warned that the overflow of Muslim faithful on to the streets at prayer time when mosques are packed to capacity risks undermining the French secular tradition separating state and religion.
 
Interior Minister Claude Guéant on August 8 told Muslims who have been praying on the streets of Paris that they should utilize a disused barracks instead. "Praying in the street is something that is not acceptable," Guéant said. "It has to stop."
 
Meanwhile, France ushered in Ramadan by inaugurating a new mega-mosque for 2,000 worshipers in Strasbourg, where the Muslim population has reached 15%. Construction also continues apace of a new mega-mosque in Marseille, France's second-largest city where the Muslim population has reached 25% (or 250,000). The Grand Mosque – which at more than 8,300 square meters (92,000 square feet) will accommodate up to 7,000 worshippers in a vast prayer hall – is designed to be the biggest and most potent symbol of Islam's place in modern France.
 
Boubakeur, of the Grande Mosque of Paris, says the construction of even more mosques – paid for by French taxpayers – would ease the "pressure, frustration and the sense of injustice" felt by many French Muslims. "Open a mosque and you close a prison," says Boubakeur.
 
But Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan has implied that the construction of mosques and minarets actually is part of a strategy for the Islamization of Europe. Publicly repeating the words of a 1912 poem written by the Turkish nationalist poet Ziya Gökalp, Erdogan said: "The mosques are our barracks, the domes our helmets, the minarets our bayonets and the faithful our soldiers."
 
Reflecting on the retreat of Catholicism and the rise of Islam in France, Archbishop Giuseppe Bernardini, an Italian Franciscan who heads the Izmir archdiocese in Turkey, and who has lived in the Islamic world for more than 40 years, has recounted a conversation he once had with a Muslim leader, who told him: "Thanks to your democratic laws, we will invade you. Thanks to our religious laws, we will dominate you."

http://www.hudson-ny.org/2355/france-islam-overtaking-catholicism

[Mornac]

Converts	Small | Large

[Mornac]

Europe & the Eucharist	Small | Large

[ivanm]

Mornac's rage against the Catholicism enjoyed by well over 99.9% of all Catholics is merely an expression of the rage he he has for his wife.  He is projecting his wife's refusal to subject herself to his fanaticism onto the rest of Catholicism.  He is a Mel Gibson waiting to happen.

You need to leave his family affairs out of your posts.  It is none of your damned business.

[johnhp]

You need to leave his family affairs out of your posts.  It is none of your damned business.

Ivan

He mentioned it and until he did i never understood his rage.

[ivanm]

Ivan

He mentioned it and until he did i never understood his rage.

So now you understand his rage.  Keep it to yourself.

[johnhp]

So now you understand his rage.  Keep it to yourself.

Ivan, Go. Fuck. Yourself.

[ivanm]

The Long Goodbye

Mornac you need to face reality.  If an institution does not change to meet the needs and preferences of the times then it can really suffer and falter.  

And knocking Prostentantism is no way to win converts. If it is any clue, some of the more fundamental protestant sects see Catholicism as the heresy and not the other way around.

I drink coffee with a man an a woman.  She is a widow now, but her husband was a pastor in a rather fundamentalist sect or subset of a sect, and the guy is a Catholic. What a strange pairing.  The guy mentioned yesterday that the mass in the local church is done in English rather than in Latin, and prefers the English one because it is easier to understand than the Latin version .

Logically speaking, it seems that a person who does not go to church on a regular basis would get more out of an
English  service than he would sitting there fighting the language barrier posed by the Latin.

There is more than one way to get to Heaven Mornac, so if someone is sincere and is trying tfhen who are you to judge him?  I think you are more interested in preserving an arcance institution than you are interested in leading people to Christ.  The fact that people usually join a protestant church becasue it appeals to them rather than having been born into the church like Catholics are should tell you something about your bigoted views of what Christianity is all about.

[Pepsi]

Islamic mosques are being built more often in France than Roman Catholic churches

Well that is the dumbest statistic I've read today so far.. geez, there's so many Catholic churches built over the last 1000 years there, and so few people who go there any more they are being turned into coffee shops and night clubs..

[Mornac]

Mornac you need to face reality.  If an institution does not change to meet the needs and preferences of the times then it can really suffer and falter.

--The Church exists to meet the needs of the times but not the preferences. I don’t deny that it can suffer and falter – one need only look at what’s happening to it today. It cannot however fail. We have our divine Founder’s word on that. He’s seen us through worse times than these over the past two millinia and I’m sure there will be other bleak eras in the future. We may suffer and falter, but we never expire.
 

And knocking Prostentantism is no way to win converts.

--I don’t “knock” Protestantism. I only point out its faults as compared to the Truth as I know it. Protestants do the same thing to us. I never whine about it – I invite it. When two people hold different ideas about what the truth is, the only way to discern which is right and which is wrong is to have a discussion about it. The only people who are ever offended by that are secular relativists who get all queasy when people confront each other about the Truth. It reminds them that there really is such a thing no matter how much they wish there were not.

If it is any clue, some of the more fundamental protestant sects see Catholicism as the heresy and not the other way around.

--That may be a newsflash to you ivan, but for those of us in the business of discerning the truth, it’s as old as Protestantism itself.

I drink coffee with a man an a woman.  She is a widow now, but her husband was a pastor in a rather fundamentalist sect or subset of a sect, and the guy is a Catholic. What a strange pairing.

--I know a Belarusian fellow –Traditional rite Catholic – who’s married to a Muslim woman. People of faith are capable of many extraordinary things.

The guy mentioned yesterday that the mass in the local church is done in English rather than in Latin, and prefers the English one because it is easier to understand than the Latin version.

--He probably grew up with it. Anyone who’s familiar with the traditional Roman rite knows that Latin is very easy to follow especially if one uses a Missal (Mass book).

Logically speaking, it seems that a person who does not go to church on a regular basis would get more out of an English service than he would sitting there fighting the language barrier posed by the Latin.

--Not if he simply read the Mass in a Missal from front to back. In the traditional Roman rite there is no active participation in the Mass by the worshiper. He is only there to witness the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass. He needn’t understand a word of what’s being said. He only has to understand that the Sacrifice of the Alar is the self-same Sacrifice of Calvary.

There is more than one way to get to Heaven Mornac, so if someone is sincere and is trying tfhen who are you to judge him?

--You go on about how God only exists in the minds of men as some conceptual thing, yet you’re going to tell me about how many ways there are to get to heaven? I don’t judge sincere people as being anything other than sincere. I only compare their sincerity against my own and see whose stands up to the standards of truth. If it’s mine and not theirs, then the only charitable thing to do is to explain to them why that is and see if they don’t change their mind about it. Where’s the foul?

I think you are more interested in preserving an arcance institution than you are interested in leading people to Christ.

--You think wrong.

The fact that people usually join a protestant church becasue it appeals to them rather than having been born into the church like Catholics are should tell you something about your bigoted views of what Christianity is all about.

--Not all Catholics are born into the Church. There are hundreds of thousands every year who choose it over whatever it was they believed before. There isn’t a Catholic alive or in history who doesn’t trace their own lineage to a convert. But there is some truth about  “people… join(ing) a protestant church because it appeals to them”.