Author Topic: The Wall: It Begins  (Read 226 times)

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Online PMF2

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The Wall: It Begins
« on: February 13, 2019, 02:43:16 PM »
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/its-true-trump-really-did-start-building-more-wall-in-texas

Quote
When President Trump said Monday at a campaign rally in El Paso that, “We’ve actually started a big, big portion of the wall today at a very important location, and it’s going to go up pretty quickly over the next nine months," I assumed it was nonsense he was spreading in hopes that his supporters might not mob him on stage for so far failing to keep the central promise of his campaign.

He similarly said Tuesday at the White House, "We just started a big, big section [of wall] on the Rio Grande."

I'm happy to say I was wrong. Trump was telling the truth.

Online Pepsi

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Re: The Wall: It Begins
« Reply #1 on: February 13, 2019, 03:07:24 PM »
6 miles down, 1,949 to go.. too bad Trump sucks at negotiation and that will never happen.
absolutely nothing will be found.

there is nothing to be found.

Online Garden House Queen

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Re: The Wall: It Begins
« Reply #2 on: February 13, 2019, 05:53:24 PM »
6 miles down, 1,949 to go.. too bad Trump sucks at negotiation and that will never happen.
I'm curious...do you lock your door at night or even during the day when you're home? If you don't you're a fool...if you do...looks to me like you would understand the need for legal immigration.

Online Pepsi

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Re: The Wall: It Begins
« Reply #3 on: February 13, 2019, 07:19:12 PM »
I'm curious...do you lock your door at night or even during the day when you're home? If you don't you're a fool...if you do...looks to me like you would understand the need for legal immigration.

The front door is normally locked but other doors usually not.      Regardless I understand the need for legal immigration already.     That said, if we had zero illegal immigration vs what we do have, I'm sure it's a net gain that we have ~12 million illegal immigrants.    More people generally means more economic activity.   You may not like the brown color of immigrants skin, but they are working hard on the whole and doing jobs neither I nor my kids are going to do.    The threat and risk is being overblown because people want a scapegoat for their own failures.
absolutely nothing will be found.

there is nothing to be found.

Offline hurricanehook

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Re: The Wall: It Begins
« Reply #4 on: February 13, 2019, 08:45:45 PM »
The front door is normally locked but other doors usually not.      Regardless I understand the need for legal immigration already.     That said, if we had zero illegal immigration vs what we do have, I'm sure it's a net gain that we have ~12 million illegal immigrants.    More people generally means more economic activity.   You may not like the brown color of immigrants skin, but they are working hard on the whole and doing jobs neither I nor my kids are going to do.    The threat and risk is being overblown because people want a scapegoat for their own failures.

Pepsi ,
You are fucked up in your head.......
Really fucked up.

More than 100 illegal immigrants caught but released by the Obama administration over the last five years have gone on to be charged with murders after they were set free, according to a new report released Monday from the Center for Immigration Studies.

In all, some 121 immigrants who were freed by U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement between 2010 and 2014 have since been charged with a total of 135 homicide-related crimes. Another three immigrants were charged with murders in 2015, bringing to 124 the total number of murder suspects the government had, then released.

Two of the immigrants in question had even been convicted of homicide before, but they were released anyway and went on to rack up new murder charges again, the report said. The others had amassed 464 total criminal charges, ranging from drugs to drunken driving, before they landed on the homicide list.

The information was released to Congress by U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement, and Jessica Vaughan at the Center for Immigration Studies analyzed the data and said it shows dangerous practices.


https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/mar/14/124-illegal-immigrants-released-by-dhs-later-charg/?
absolutely nothing will be found. there is nothing to be found.

Online Garden House Queen

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Re: The Wall: It Begins
« Reply #5 on: February 13, 2019, 08:52:52 PM »
The front door is normally locked but other doors usually not.      Regardless I understand the need for legal immigration already.     That said, if we had zero illegal immigration vs what we do have, I'm sure it's a net gain that we have ~12 million illegal immigrants.    More people generally means more economic activity.   You may not like the brown color of immigrants skin, but they are working hard on the whole and doing jobs neither I nor my kids are going to do.    The threat and risk is being overblown because people want a scapegoat for their own failures.

I have no problem with people of color....any color. But....I do want immigrants to come to the US legally. I want law and order in this country. As far as your comment on economic activity....you've got it backwards. The economics is blown to hell when you consider the impact of illegals as well as legals sucking off the system as in free housing, free medical, free food, free education and etc. and etc. Don't bother to tell me I am wrong because I see it every single day.....students who get free lunches and breakfasts while wearing brand new tennis shoes and cell phones of the highest caliber and their parents do not work. Why should they....when they can go to the mail box and pick up a check. They cannot speak English so the chance of being hired for anything other than landscaping and house keeping is next to zero.

Also, don't bother to call me racist. You need to know I have a Hispanic that has been working for me going on 17 years. However....he came here legally. Get it? Legally.

As far as you and your kids not wanting to do the work that illegals do? Just be patient. You're about to find out. You and your kids will be glad to do those jobs when this country goes to hell. Things are  not going to stay the same forever. You may as well get prepared because change is coming.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2019, 09:06:48 PM by Garden House Queen »

Online Pepsi

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Re: The Wall: It Begins
« Reply #6 on: February 13, 2019, 09:43:53 PM »
More than 100 illegal immigrants caught but released by the Obama administration over the last five years have gone on to be charged with murders after they were set free, according to a new report released Monday from the Center for Immigration Studies.

100 over 5 years, that's 20 per year.   And we already know 60% of illegal immigrants came here validly on visas or passport at a reguled border.    So let's say the wall will save 8 lives per year.
  Trump's wall is estimated at $25 Billion.   That's like $3B per life saved.      Meanwhile 40,000 Americans killed by a gun /year (200,000 over 5 years)  and everyone agrees mental health is a big problem - if we spent $25B on mental health instead of a wall, let's be conservatives and say we'd save 10,000 lives per year, or 50,000 over 5 years.    If you are making a 'we need to do this to save lives' argument, would it be smarter to spend $25 Billion to save 45 lives or 50,000 lives?
absolutely nothing will be found.

there is nothing to be found.

Offline hurricanehook

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Re: The Wall: It Begins
« Reply #7 on: February 14, 2019, 01:27:15 AM »
100 over 5 years, that's 20 per year.   And we already know 60% of illegal immigrants came here validly on visas or passport at a reguled border.    So let's say the wall will save 8 lives per year.
  Trump's wall is estimated at $25 Billion.   That's like $3B per life saved.      Meanwhile 40,000 Americans killed by a gun /year (200,000 over 5 years)  and everyone agrees mental health is a big problem - if we spent $25B on mental health instead of a wall, let's be conservatives and say we'd save 10,000 lives per year, or 50,000 over 5 years.    If you are making a 'we need to do this to save lives' argument, would it be smarter to spend $25 Billion to save 45 lives or 50,000 lives?
Pepsi, nice try to deflect the whole point.
A wall and increased border security not only saves lives, but billions of dollars.
That is a fact.
pepsi, just come out and say, along with your left wing liberal buddies, you are for open borders and do not care about the sovereignty
and the safety of  the United States of America.

 
absolutely nothing will be found. there is nothing to be found.

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Re: The Wall: It Begins
« Reply #8 on: February 14, 2019, 04:01:14 AM »
6 miles down, 1,949 to go.. too bad Trump sucks at negotiation and that will never happen.


I don't think we'll ever build a physical wall along the entire border -- bits and pieces here and there perhaps. In the most high-risk areas.

I can't really figure out why the democrats oppose that idea, except, of course, that Trump is pushing it.

GWB and Obama built a wall by Juarez and the dems didn't seem to mind.


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Re: The Wall: It Begins
« Reply #9 on: February 14, 2019, 04:10:37 AM »
100 over 5 years, that's 20 per year.   And we already know 60% of illegal immigrants came here validly on visas or passport at a reguled border.    So let's say the wall will save 8 lives per year.

We don't care as much about overstays. Why? Because we know WHO they are, we know WHERE they're from, and we pretty much know WHAT they're doing in the US.

Not so with those who cross illegally. They come here without identification paperwork, some create alias names, some come with the express purpose of doing illegal things.

The second group poses a greater risk to our society than does the first group. In general.


 
Quote
Trump's wall is estimated at $25 Billion.   That's like $3B per life saved.      Meanwhile 40,000 Americans killed by a gun /year (200,000 over 5 years)  and everyone agrees mental health is a big problem - if we spent $25B on mental health instead of a wall, let's be conservatives and say we'd save 10,000 lives per year, or 50,000 over 5 years.    If you are making a 'we need to do this to save lives' argument, would it be smarter to spend $25 Billion to save 45 lives or 50,000 lives?


I don't know that we can put a price on "lives saved" but I promise you 25B will not build a wall from coast to coast. Not even close. Too many years of construction-estimating experience tell me that.

But, cost is irrelevant. We need to stop illegal immigration and a wall is just one method of doing that. Reform is another option. Creating holding facilities on the southern side of the border and not allowing refugee applicants to cross before asylum status can be determined. Catch and release is one of our biggest faux pas, after all. And, we can be much stricter about deportations. Obama did good by ramping up deportations, but we need to triple that effort. When word spreads that  no one can enter here unless they do so legally, we'll have fewer border jumpers.

My point with the OP was just to demonstrate that Trump is beginning to build a wall. To his supporters (and others) that will translate into the President trying to keep his biggest promise.


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Re: The Wall: It Begins
« Reply #10 on: February 14, 2019, 04:13:25 AM »
Pepsi, nice try to deflect the whole point.
A wall and increased border security not only saves lives, but billions of dollars.
That is a fact.
pepsi, just come out and say, along with your left wing liberal buddies, you are for open borders and do not care about the sovereignty
and the safety of  the United States of America.

This is accurate. While liberals will say illegals pay taxes -- they do -- the truth is they pay less in taxes than they absorb, via earned income credits, programs and amenities designed to support lower-income Americans.


Online Pepsi

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Re: The Wall: It Begins
« Reply #11 on: February 14, 2019, 08:55:15 AM »

I don't think we'll ever build a physical wall along the entire border -- bits and pieces here and there perhaps. In the most high-risk areas.

yeah, bits and pieces here and there

Quote
I can't really figure out why the democrats oppose that idea, except, of course, that Trump is pushing it.

Democrats don't oppose that idea, because that's not the idea being proposed by Trump.   
absolutely nothing will be found.

there is nothing to be found.

Online Pepsi

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Re: The Wall: It Begins
« Reply #12 on: February 14, 2019, 08:56:54 AM »
A wall and increased border security not only saves lives, but billions of dollars.
That is a fact.

Then you'll have no trouble linking to valid research demonstrating how spending $25B on a wall is going to save us "billions of dollars"?
absolutely nothing will be found.

there is nothing to be found.

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Re: The Wall: It Begins
« Reply #13 on: February 14, 2019, 09:14:36 AM »
yeah, bits and pieces here and there

Democrats don't oppose that idea, because that's not the idea being proposed by Trump.

Well, we're not going to get an entire wall because it's not fiscally feasible, and the demographics of the some of the border region are not conducive to construction. My point, however, is more about the backpedaling going on with the democrats. In 2017, Trump asked for 25B for the wall, in exchange for granting Dreamers a path to citizenship. Democrats changed that to 25B,  spread out over a 10-year period. That was more per-year than they're willing to go now, which seems counterproductive.

What we're hearing now is demonizing of the wall idea, altogether, although no one demonized Obama for his part in building a portion of the wall. It's kind of hypocritical, if you ask me -- but, it's politics and I realize both sides do it -- so -- expected.

I think what we're going to see now is a battle of wills, and that won't solve anything. We need real solutions. We need both sides to come to the table and fix this mess. We could implement stronger immigration regulations in addition to building bits of wall in strategic locations. We could increase LEGAL worker programs at the same time.

What we need is for both sides to quit making the issue something it's not. The GOP needs to admit that the majority of the people coming here illegally are people who want better lives -- not animals. The Dems need to admit that we need stricter policing and regulations to stop illegal immigration.

In short -- illegals are NOT monsters, but they're NOT angels, either. We could solve this if we weren't so darned divided these days.

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Re: The Wall: It Begins
« Reply #14 on: February 14, 2019, 09:59:02 AM »
Then you'll have no trouble linking to valid research demonstrating how spending $25B on a wall is going to save us "billions of dollars"?

Well, a wall, in and of itself, might not save that much money, but if we deported all illegals, we'd save a good chunk.







You can check out the numbers and methodology here:

https://www.fairus.org/issue/publications-resources/fiscal-burden-illegal-immigration-united-states-taxpayers